Living alone in the small town of Alqosh in the Nineveh plains, 81-year-old Karim Toma Ismail was for many years a cook inside Saddam Hussein’s palaces. In a conversation with Rudaw, Toma recounts many moments of his life and work with Iraq’s former dictator. “Saddam loved okra stew and many evenings he barbequed the meat himself,” Toma is not sure if Saddam Hussein was really hanged and he believes that he was not a bad person, saying it was more the people around him.
Rudaw: You were born in this small town of Alqosh. How did you end up in Saddam’s palace?
Karim Toma Ismail: Some of my relatives were in Baghdad and I used to visit them often. Then after I finished high school I went to Baghdad and started working at a bar with a relative. I wanted to learn cooking and for that I went into the bar’s kitchen regularly and observed the cook and learned a lot from him.
How did you become Saddam’s cook?
Before going to the palace, from 1956 onwards I was working as a cook at the Baghdad airport. I stayed there for many years. Then when I found out that the president’s palace needed a cook I went there through a friend of mine. Ahmad Hassan Bakir was president then. They asked me many questions at first, then they told me to start work. In the beginning I worked as a simple worker in the kitchen then I became a cook.
When did you see Saddam Hussein for the first time?
Once I was busy making rice when a man came inside with a number of bodyguards. He was holding a bread and said, “I’m hungry, what’s ready?” and I told him, “It’s forbidden to enter the kitchen.” After he left one of my friends said, “why did you say that? Do you know who he is? He is Saddam Hussein, the vice president.”
What kind of food did he like most?
For breakfast he would eat hardboiled eggs or yoghurt. For lunch he would eat anything that was available. But for dinner he loved barbequed meat and he often prepared it himself.
What about Kurdish food? Did you ever make him any?
We prepared for him eight types of meals on a regular basis. We even made for him dolma and kuba. Among the Kurdish food, he loved dolma most and we prepared it for him once a month.
Where did you get the ingredients?
We would get all supplies from Italy.
Was there ever an attempt on Saddam’s life through poisoning his food?
Yes, when I was there. One evening Saddam was sitting in the garden of the palace. He was then vice president to Ahmad Hassan Bakir. A young man brought him a glass of juice but one of his guards named Kamil Hanna snatched the glass and didn’t let him drink it. Saddam got really angry and said why did you do that and the guard replied, “Sir, you’ll know later.” Hanna then took the juice to the kitchen lab and after they found out about it, Saddam called for the young man, but I don’t know what happened to him.
How many people worked in Saddam’s kitchen?
We worked in the kitchens of the Tigress (Dijla) and presidential palace. We were eight cooks and worked in two shifts. Each kitchen had a staff of 400 people, but they worked based on the needs of that day. Whenever a foreign delegation visited everyone was at work.
Were there any Kurds in those kitchens?
Saddam mostly trusted the Christians. 80 percent of his kitchen staff were Christians. But there I also came to know a Yezidi Kurd.
How much were you paid and do you have a pension from that?
When I first got the job my monthly salary was 120 dinars. Then I got retired after working in Saddam’s kitchen for 15 years in 1991. My pension is 750,000 dinars.
Saddam Hussein killed many people. Were you aware of any of that? Did you ever regret serving such a man?
Saddam was not a bad man. The people around him were bad. He was a very different person himself. He couldn’t tolerate a mistake even from his own father. He acted like a child with children, like a president with presidents and like an old man with the elderly. But his sons were not good. Especially his son Uday who was like a dog. Qusay was better. He even wanted to learn Kurdish.
Do you have any memorable moments with Saddam?
I have two letters of appreciation with Saddam’s own autograph. But I have no photos with him because upon entry we were inspected and could not take cameras with us. Also one afternoon I was sitting near the edge of the swimming pool when Saddam came for a swim. Then he came and sat next to me and said, “I love your food.” He then called the photographer and we took some photos but I never got them.
When did you see Saddam for the last time?
In 1991 when I got retired. It was my last day there at that job. Saddam gave us 5,000 dinars as present and a letter of gratitude.
How did you feel when he was hanged?
Who says Saddam was hanged? I won’t believe it unless I see it with my own eyes.
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